Comments on: UFE results this Friday

By: Krupo

Krupo — Wed, 18 Aug 2010 04:15:57 +0000

Rima, you’re assuming that if you wrote the exam once, you’d automatically do better the second time, since you have “experience.”

It’s a tricky exam — often people who fail once, will fail again either for the same reason, or yet ANOTHER reason. There seems to simply be more risk on that front.

By: Rima

Rima — Sat, 31 Jul 2010 21:41:11 +0000

Hi, I am a university student considering pursuing the CA stream. I am now researching the requirements and reading about the process to become a CA. One thing that is confusing me is the pass rates that are posted up on websites. If, for example, the UFE had a pass rate of 74.1%, does that mean that 74.1% of the people that attempted the UFE succeeded? If this is the case, then why is it that in some websites, it is given that a second time attempt had a pass rate of 41.%. How is it the first time writers have a higher pass rate?

By: Krupo

Krupo — Thu, 06 Dec 2007 05:04:09 +0000

6 hours? Ours is 13. Albeit spread over three days.

Of course, geographically NZ is the size of one state or province or so. The reason for the separate regional configurations… well that’d be an interesting story to learn. But I’m sure Organizational Design folks could spin a yarn to explain it.

The total time is similar — 4 year degree, 30 months experience. So effectively also 7 years.

I’ve said it before and will say it again: work experience definitely helps with our exams. I was glad to get a year under my belt going into the final.

By: Andrew

Andrew — Wed, 05 Dec 2007 06:08:46 +0000

Its quite interesting how you have different regions with different entry requirements in the same country (like the States and Canada). In New Zealand we have the NZICA and CPA Australia as an alternate, although pretty much everyone goes for NZICA’s CA qualification.
It involves 4 years full-time degree/bachelors level study with specific papers and a balance of Accounting/Business and Liberal papers, then one year general work experience at a workplace with a registered mentor, after which you take ‘PCE 1″ Professional Competency Exam.
After this you do two years work at an Approved Training Organisation doing Accounting work, participate in Professional Accounting School (series of weekend workshops) and then finally PCE 2, the mother of all exams which is 6 hours long.
All in all it takes 7 years to become a CA. I guess you’ve got to make it challenging and not easy to make sure that the CA designation is not just ‘handed out’ and that it is well earnt.
Maybe it is better to have work experience required before being able to sit the exams?

By: Krupo

Krupo — Wed, 05 Dec 2007 04:14:05 +0000

Good points. My comments runneth over — I turned them into a proper blog entry here:

http://krupo.ca/archive/2007/12/04/do-you-want-to-write-now-with-a-50-chance-of-success-or-wait-until-next-year-and-have-a-better-chance.aspx

Damn, that’s a long URL.

By: Do you want to write now with a 50% chance of success, or wait until next year and have a better chance? - A Counting School

Wed, 05 Dec 2007 04:11:02 +0000

[…] Neil has a fun little conversation going on the topic of the 2007 UFE.The discussion branched off into the question of why Ontario did worse than the national average and what could be done to improve matters. Could forcing candidates into a 2-year program improve matters? Paul says no, “Low provincial/regional pass rates are always hard to swallow and can undoubtedly be improved by increasing the amount of screening and the length of the education period prior to allowing a UFE candidate to write for the first time. […]

By: Paul

Paul — Tue, 04 Dec 2007 20:41:59 +0000

Krupo and Edmund,

Low provincial/regional pass rates are always hard to swallow and can undoubtedly be improved by increasing the amount of screening and the length of the education period prior to allowing a UFE candidate to write for the first time.

However, I question whether a higher UFE pass rate would make the program more attractive to potential entrants. After all, what’s the benefit of making it easier to get THROUGH the UFE if it makes it harder to get TO the UFE in the first place?

Here’s a hypothetical example: Assume a CKE pass rate of 80% and an SOA pass rate of 80%. In this example, 64% of candidates will make it TO the UFE in their first year. If the UFE first-time writer pass rate is 75%, the flowthrough rate in the first year would be 48%.

This doesn’t inspire any confidence until you compare it to some of the other programs in the country where candidates have a 0% chance of getting through the UFE in their first year because they are essentially two-year programs.

In a similar vein, Ontario could improve its UFE pass rate by dropping its CKE and/or SOA pass rates to screen candidates more aggressively. The UFE “headline number” would be more attractive, but there would probably be even fewer successful candidates since so many more wouldn’t make it TO the UFE.

In short, I think that Ontario has made some conscious decisions to make its program more attractive and to give as many candidates as reasonable a shot at the UFE as soon as possible. I’ll also bet that these decision-makers have to suffer bruised egos, but do so with the knowledge that they’ve helped as many candidates as possible make it TO and THROUGH the UFE.

By: Edmund

Edmund — Mon, 03 Dec 2007 14:59:46 +0000

Thank you Krupo. About the Ontario UFE results — there is an article in the current edition of Checkmark (Autumn 07, p. 15) that discusses the various factors that affect UFE pass rates. It may explain why Ontario is below the national average — it seems we go into the UFE with less work experience under our belt than other provinces. For students from my school, it is possible to write the UFE with only 4 months of public firm experience. I wonder if the ICAO should change their professional program, like maybe make it necessary to work for a year or so before writing the CKE/SOA/UFE.

By: Krupo

Krupo — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 21:24:44 +0000

Congrats Edmund. And all writers — Ontario got hit hard this year, ICAO writers averaged around 68% from what I heard.

By: Mike

Mike — Sun, 02 Dec 2007 17:08:21 +0000

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many thanks